It’s time for more of our wide-ranging interview with Roy Elkins, a music industry veteran who is the founder and owner of Broadjam, which pre-dates social media, when indie artists had almost no path to industry decision-makers.
ROY: Well, I’ve got a little challenge here in front of me. As you know, I’m fighting cancer. I was diagnosed with bile duct cancer in December. The doctor gave me about 14 months, but I believe I'll beat it. But I’ve never waned once from believing I was going to beat it. I believe I’m going to beat it.
It’s a balance of the spiritual and emotional, and your belief in the future. And there are days where emotionally you’re drained. You’re just tired of thinking about it. That’s where I have to focus and meditate and tell myself I have to have the intellect, the brainpower kick in and push the emotions aside.
So I go sit at the piano or I take my dogs for a walk - it spiritually makes me feel good. That’s how I deal with it personally.
From a business perspective, I do want to get rid of a lot of things that are just less important. And I don’t want my wife to have to deal with this, but I want Broadjam to continue. If the worst-case scenario happens, I certainly want to continue; we have two hundred and forty thousand members.
It’s been, as you know, a passionate project for me.
You don’t really start a site like this to make money. If you do, I suggest you get into another business.
CHARLIE: That’s understandable. That’s fair.
ROY: I love what I do, Charlie. I love it. I love talking to our members. Somebody will send me a song and they say, what do you think, Roy? I just give my honest opinion and sometimes it helps them rethink a verse or a note
CHARLIE: But like Broadjam, it seems like the things that are that you’ve built there that are the best, the community and the ability, the community, the reviews and then the review system is brilliant. You got to review some to get that keeps it. So like all these other ones are dried up and no reviews. So what you’ve created is a really good community and I think a pathway and some tools and in conventions and stuff. Yeah. For artists who wouldn’t know, who are confused. There’s so many ways to go. You’ve given a lot of artists a path to like how they get things places.
ROY: I think it’s fair. 93% of our members don’t pay, which I'm proud of - it shows we're serving musicians first, even if it doesn't cover all our costs.
One person recently was placed in Guardians of the Galaxy and got a nice payday and, you know, they get that big check. I feel like that's rewarding for us.
But the frustrating part is most musicians are not going to be successful.
CHARLIE: It’s a hard game.
ROY: Yeah, for sure. And what I always tell people when I lecture is, you know, no matter how successful you are, just remember why we do it, why you do it.
And none of us picked up a guitar when we were seven or eight years old because we were thinking about ... well, we thought about being rock stars and we write on the house, but we did it because we love to do it. And in the fact that I can still at my age go set it up, you know, or pick up a guitar ... I mean, that’s worth a fortune, you know, to me.
It's important to take critical feedback objectively, even if our egos resist. Artists often miss small issues someone else will catch.
But I think, you know, that’s one of the reasons we have the pro reviews on the site too. And the peer review mechanism is there to get an objective review and listen to what others have to say. And if you don’t agree, just move on.
CHARLIE: Exactly. We should listen. And if there’s a specific criticism, like, eight out of ten reviews are telling you that, you better take that seriously.
ROY: Yeah, it’s a great example. I love to watch American Idol. In the early days, it was almost a mockery of some of the people that came on. In the last few years, they focus only on the great singers. I’m amazed at how many great singers come through there. People say none of them have ever made it. But my God, I can list 20 that have platinum albums, maybe a hundred by now.
This year’s crop of singers is phenomenal. I get chills thinking of 15-year-old high school kids singing and just knocking it out of the park, and their ability to take feedback. The judges are lighter, more productive and constructive than before. And that’s how you should give feedback. Say, if this was my song, I would do this. Or think about phrasing this differently. Very rarely do they insult people like they used to years ago.
Even if feedback is crappy, just say thank you and move on. Occasionally, somebody gives a nasty review. If it’s really unfair, I just delete it.
CHARLIE: I mean, you go places all the time. You bump into great musicians at a hotel in Tucson and find the best three-piece jazz band you've ever seen. If this was a meritocracy, they could be on a bigger stage somewhere.
ROY: Yeah. I always say, if you want to quit making music, get in the music business. That’s the business side of it.
CHARLIE: Roy, I never knew you were invited to be on the Pro Bowlers Tour. How good were you?
ROY:
I qualified for the tour when I was 18 and won a couple local tournaments in Michigan. I worked in a bowling alley as a kid and happened to get good. I loved music the whole time, and I remember thinking, if I could go on the Pro Tour and play in a club at night, that would be ideal.
At a point when I was frustrated with music, I had a chance to work for Brunswick as an assistant manager. They offered Memphis, and my first thought was Beale Street and the blues.
I got there, worked six days a week, 3 -to-11, and one day I saw Duck Dunn, my favorite bass player growing up, in the bowling alley. All I could think about was music. I happened to find a job listing for a music store in Memphis.
The bowling alley required short hair, so I grabbed a tie and a suit and went and stood in line. I hit it off with the manager and was hired a couple hours later. Had I not picked up that newspaper, I don’t think this career would have started.
Every day was only about half of what I made at the bowling alley, but I loved it.
Life is full of serendipity. I spotted a guitar sales ad in Memphis and ended up getting hired, which launched my career in music gear.
CHARLIE: That move got you into the store, get you further into gear and then working on innovating in tech and gear, right?
ROY: When I went to work in the store, I knew a little about synths. Back then, in the late 70s, early 80s, there weren't any books on synths. You had to go to the library. Keyboard magazines were like my Bible.
When people came in and asked questions, most just didn't know this stuff. So, I started getting regulars and started my own little training program in my living room. Then sampling came out - I got into the E2, the K250, and Sonic's Mirage. I fell in love with the product, learned to sample everything in my apartment, and gave the sounds to my customers.
In Sonic, I was selling Mirages and teaching employees, reps, and artists. I worked in Artist Relations at Sonic, teaching and supporting musicians like Rick Wakeman, Joe Walsh, and Greg Allman, learning how focused top artists are on their craft.
I learned how focused these artists are - how they live for making great music, no matter the stories you hear.
Eventually I got into Sonic Foundry, helping that company off the ground. That's when I moved more into the business side and less tech, which I sometimes regret. At Sonic, I was at director level, running Artist Relations and marketing stints. I traveled the world, got to play gear every day, and got deep into technology.
Later, Broadjam moved me more into the business side, though I stayed involved in tech tools.
CHARLIE: I guess that’s what I was getting with tech. You’re still closer to the music itself.
ROY: It’s funny, you talk about those guys being that focused. At that level, all they had to do was make music. Today, every musician has to be their own contract lawyer, promoter, social media expert - all of it. You kind of have to be the CEO of your own life, your own career.
I break it into three areas when I lecture: your creative, your business, and you.
Creatively: can you play, sing, write, harmonize, read music, and play by ear? If so, you'll work forever.
On the business side, you've got to know a little about marketing, publishing, licensing, management deals, and touring. Learn a little every day. If you don't, you can get screwed. People love your music, your heart is fluttering, and next thing you know you've signed away half your stuff. Knowing the basics saves you.
But the most important area is you. Are you getting along with people? Are you accountable? On time? Honest? Do you lift others? Everyone wants to work with someone fun and easy to work with. I'd rather work with a lesser musician who's enjoyable than someone brilliant who's a headache.
CHARLIE: And if somebody’s going to be an asshole, you've got to be the world's best to get away with it, like Reggie Jackson.
ROY: Exactly. That's why I say the "you" part is most important. Lift others in the room, and it comes back to you. Early in my career, especially at Sonic, I had bosses who told me my job was to make people fired up about our product. That mindset applies to music too - how involved you are, how much you lift others, matters as much as anything else.
CHARLIE: I want to ask one more thing. You are still kind of involved in kind of regional, regional group, Wisconsin music?
ROY: I've chaired the Madison Area Music Association for over 20 years. We expanded the board recently, and I've just stepped away.
I'm still the chair of the Wisconsin area music industry. I expect at some point, in the next year, I’ll probably step away from that. I’m a very, very proud NAMM member. I consult NAMM and we handle a lot of the voting for NAMM. We handled the vote for the Academy of Country Music Awards for a while. We still consult them on other votes. If it's helping local musicians, we'll do it for nothing.
CHARLIE: Do you run some sort of Wisconsin Music Awards too?
ROY: Yeah, the Madison Area Music Association has their awards, and we're in the middle of the Wisconsin area music industry awards. Both are in the first round of voting now. People ask why do awards - it's silly to say one music is better than another - but it's fun and a way to celebrate music.
CHARLIE: It's just such a silly thing.
ROY: Well, I tell everybody this, there's no such thing as the best record, right?
There's no such thing as the best guitar player.
It is the most favorite person or album in the population that's voting. It isn't the best album but it's the favorite one of the population who voted. That's it. That's all awards are.
